On 2008-07-07, Rob <ramseyrt@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I have an older computer (Dell Optiplex GX240) that has only an
> internal CDROM. After I boot this system using the OpenSuSE v11
> LiveCD, navigate through the installation menu choices, and reboot
> the system,

Are you saying that at this stage everything is installaed and this is
the initial boot?

> the system displays a blank screen after the standard POST
> messages. I've left the system sitting in this state for as much as
> 30 minutes without anything being displayed on the screen.
>
>
> The only activity that I see on the system is a steady HD light. The
> numlock and caplock lights to change when I press the numlock and
> caplock keys which would suggest that the system isn't locked up.
> The
> hard drive is healthy and I'm using the entire disk for the Open SuSE
> OS; nothing special partition wise.

So it takes at least some instructions from the keyboard but does not
show any feedback.

Assuming this was a GUI install, try alt ctrl F1 to go to text mode
virtual konsole.

Anything there?

Vahis
--
Training new things here:
http://waxborg.servepics.com
"The only thing more expensive than training is the lack of it"
Henry Ford

Hello,

I appreciate your replies. Let me be more detailed.

This computer was running Windows 2000 until I used a Knoppix bootable
ISO and shredded the hard drive. I decided to shred the drive so that
I'd have a totally fresh disk to put SuSE on. (using shred -n 1 -v -z /
dev/hda)

Because I have run Windows 2k on it, booted it off of a knoppix iso
and shredded the HD, and booted it off of the Open SuSE v11 Live CD, I
know that this system is operational. Performing an fdisk -l shows
the partitions on the system, looking at /proc/cpuinfo and /proc/
meminfo, the system reports the correct CPU, RAM, and HD info. If
this system was broken in any way I would expect it to have showen
some kind of bad behavior at some point during all of this.

This computer has a CDROM, no DVD reader. So, I'm forced to use the
Live CD for install. I attempted to connect an external USB DVD
reader but the BIOS doesn't see the external USB device at boot time.

So, I boot off of the Open SuSE v11 32Bit Live CD as described on the
opensuse.org website http://en.opensuse.org/Installation/11.0_Live_CD
.. I select Open SuSE 11 at the boot time splash screen and the system
begins to boot off of the CD. After a brief period I'm presented with
a desktop populated with a green wallpaper and icons as described on
the installation proceedure. I double click on the Install icon and
process through the presented GUI menus accepting the license
agreement, selecting my timezone, creating the first user, and
selecting a partiton setup. There's really no way to screw up the
install unless someone intentionally goes in a fools with the
partition stuff; which I'm not. I click on the install button on the
last install screen and the system begins the install process. This
take a little while but it completes without any errors. The last
window presented at the end of the installation process states that I
need to reboot the system with the Live CD removed. So, I select
reboot from the start menu and select reboot. When the system begins
flashing the BIOS stuff I eject the CDROM. The system completes the
POST and then I'm presented with a blank black screen with a blinking
cursor in the top left corner. I've tried rebooting the system
several times with the same result. I've also tried all of the F?
keys on the keyboard and nothing happens. The system does beep one
time per keypress after I've pressed the keys maybe 15 times.

I've gone through the install process again, taking pictures of each
step. As a Solaris, Irix, and Linux system admin with over ten years
of experience, I'm very capable of performing the instructions
described on the opensuse.org website. My problem is that there's no
way to start attacking this problem since I'm not even seeing the GRUB
boot menu. I'm guessing that something special will have to done
during the install process to get at least the boot loader running.
You can view the pictures here: http://picasaweb.google.com/ramseyrt...1LiveCDInstall

From a trouble-shooting standpoint it would be easy to say that the
user is screwing something up. That just isn't the case. Again,
since I've followed the install proceedure verbatum I don't know why
this isn't working.

Thanks,

Rob Ramsey
Colorado Springs

On 2008-07-10, Rob <ramseyrt@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I appreciate your replies. Let me be more detailed.
>
> This computer was running Windows 2000 until I used a Knoppix bootable
> ISO and shredded the hard drive. I decided to shred the drive so that
> I'd have a totally fresh disk to put SuSE on. (using shred -n 1 -v -z /
> dev/hda)
>
> Because I have run Windows 2k on it, booted it off of a knoppix iso
> and shredded the HD, and booted it off of the Open SuSE v11 Live CD, I
> know that this system is operational. Performing an fdisk -l shows
> the partitions on the system, looking at /proc/cpuinfo and /proc/
> meminfo, the system reports the correct CPU, RAM, and HD info. If
> this system was broken in any way I would expect it to have showen
> some kind of bad behavior at some point during all of this.
>
> This computer has a CDROM, no DVD reader. So, I'm forced to use the
> Live CD for install. I attempted to connect an external USB DVD
> reader but the BIOS doesn't see the external USB device at boot time.

I've been installing Suses since 9.1 in 2004.
And I can tell you that 11.0 can be a bitch to install.
Its Live installer is something I won't
touch at all.

You'll be better of with the Net Install CD if you have a wired NIC.

There you also have the "Repair Installed System" if you need it
afterwards. Live CD doesn't have that option.

You may still use the Live CD to run live from it and do manual fixing
on things if needed.

<snip>

I hear you. I've seen that kind of things while installing a couple of
them recently. Different sets of disks, somewhat different problems, but
very much like yours.

>
> From a trouble-shooting standpoint it would be easy to say that the
> user is screwing something up.

Not necessarily at all.

> That just isn't the case. Again,
> since I've followed the install proceedure verbatum I don't know why
> this isn't working.

I'm a big fan of openSUSE but this one's installer is buggy.

Best of luck, don't give up. Once you get it up and running it runs just
fine (knocking wood.


Vahis
--
Training new things here:
http://waxborg.servepics.com
"The only thing more expensive than training is the lack of it"
Henry Ford

On Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:21:29 -0700, Rob wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I appreciate your replies. Let me be more detailed.
>
> This computer was running Windows 2000 until I used a Knoppix bootable
> ISO and shredded the hard drive. I decided to shred the drive so that
> I'd have a totally fresh disk to put SuSE on. (using shred -n 1 -v -z /
> dev/hda)
>
> Because I have run Windows 2k on it, booted it off of a knoppix iso and
> shredded the HD, and booted it off of the Open SuSE v11 Live CD, I know
> that this system is operational. Performing an fdisk -l shows the
> partitions on the system, looking at /proc/cpuinfo and /proc/ meminfo,
> the system reports the correct CPU, RAM, and HD info. If this system
> was broken in any way I would expect it to have showen some kind of bad
> behavior at some point during all of this.
>
> This computer has a CDROM, no DVD reader. So, I'm forced to use the
> Live CD for install. I attempted to connect an external USB DVD reader
> but the BIOS doesn't see the external USB device at boot time.
>
> So, I boot off of the Open SuSE v11 32Bit Live CD as described on the
> opensuse.org website http://en.opensuse.org/Installation/11.0_Live_CD .
> I select Open SuSE 11 at the boot time splash screen and the system
> begins to boot off of the CD. After a brief period I'm presented with a
> desktop populated with a green wallpaper and icons as described on the
> installation proceedure. I double click on the Install icon and process
> through the presented GUI menus accepting the license agreement,
> selecting my timezone, creating the first user, and selecting a partiton
> setup. There's really no way to screw up the install unless someone
> intentionally goes in a fools with the partition stuff; which I'm not.
> I click on the install button on the last install screen and the system
> begins the install process. This take a little while but it completes
> without any errors. The last window presented at the end of the
> installation process states that I need to reboot the system with the
> Live CD removed. So, I select reboot from the start menu and select
> reboot. When the system begins flashing the BIOS stuff I eject the
> CDROM. The system completes the POST and then I'm presented with a
> blank black screen with a blinking cursor in the top left corner. I've
> tried rebooting the system several times with the same result. I've
> also tried all of the F? keys on the keyboard and nothing happens. The
> system does beep one time per keypress after I've pressed the keys maybe
> 15 times.
>
> I've gone through the install process again, taking pictures of each
> step. As a Solaris, Irix, and Linux system admin with over ten years of
> experience, I'm very capable of performing the instructions described on
> the opensuse.org website. My problem is that there's no way to start
> attacking this problem since I'm not even seeing the GRUB boot menu.
> I'm guessing that something special will have to done during the install
> process to get at least the boot loader running. You can view the
> pictures here: http://picasaweb.google.com/ramseyrt...1LiveCDInstall
>
> From a trouble-shooting standpoint it would be easy to say that the user
> is screwing something up. That just isn't the case. Again, since I've
> followed the install proceedure verbatum I don't know why this isn't
> working.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Rob Ramsey
> Colorado Springs

One of the photos shows sda2 as install partition and sda1 as swap - now
I am no expert, but I wouldnt expect that to work. I would have thought
the other way around - I assume grub and swap are being written to the
same place, and that cant be good, can it?

Vahis wrote:
> I've been installing Suses since 9.1 in 2004.
> And I can tell you that 11.0 can be a bitch to install.
> Its Live installer is something I won't
> touch at all.

I have installed it on my machines and had absolutely no problem at all.

> You'll be better of with the Net Install CD if you have a wired NIC.

As long as your network will work.

> There you also have the "Repair Installed System" if you need it
> afterwards. Live CD doesn't have that option.

Didn't yet need it, but a valid point, provided you get the network to
work.

> I'm a big fan of openSUSE but this one's installer is buggy.

Then I must be doing something wrong as I had no problems whatsoever.

houghi
--
You can have my keyboard ...
if you can pry it from my dead, cold, stiff fingers

It's been my experience that swap is always before the root
filesystem. The center of the disk is faster then the rest so you
want swap first. The bootloader stuff goes on the very beginning of
the disk but that area isn't recognised as a filesystem.

-Rob

On 2008-07-10, houghi <houghi@houghi.org.invalid> wrote:
> Vahis wrote:
>> I've been installing Suses since 9.1 in 2004.
>> And I can tell you that 11.0 can be a bitch to install.
>> Its Live installer is something I won't
>> touch at all.
>
> I have installed it on my machines and had absolutely no problem at all.

I think I remember you had some confusion a while back with mixed
IDE/SATA envoronment?

I know I did.

One reason is that there's no option to have a proper look/edit at
partitions before starting the actual installation.

Or the bootloader setup.

Maybe that's a feature but IMHO it's a bad one.

Also are you saying that the Live Installer is fine for you?

It's not here.

>> You'll be better of with the Net Install CD if you have a wired NIC.
>
> As long as your network will work.

Linux is meant to be in a network. Wireless is another story but I
haven't seen that a functional wired NIC would cause problems.

And all mirrors being all down is rare.

>
>> There you also have the "Repair Installed System" if you need it
>> afterwards. Live CD doesn't have that option.
>
> Didn't yet need it, but a valid point, provided you get the network to
> work.

See above.
>
>> I'm a big fan of openSUSE but this one's installer is buggy.
>
> Then I must be doing something wrong as I had no problems whatsoever.

Try upgrade :)

I hadn't problems with upgrading before 11.0.
Maybe I have done something wrong when the installer of 11.0 has found
Xen in my machines more than once. There's never been one in any of my
machines.

Vahis
--
Training new things here:
http://waxborg.servepics.com
"The only thing more expensive than training is the lack of it"
Henry Ford

Vahis wrote:
>
>
> On 2008-07-10, houghi <houghi@houghi.org.invalid> wrote:
>> Vahis wrote:
>>> I've been installing Suses since 9.1 in 2004.
>>> And I can tell you that 11.0 can be a bitch to install.
>>> Its Live installer is something I won't
>>> touch at all.
>>
>> I have installed it on my machines and had absolutely no problem at all.
>
> I think I remember you had some confusion a while back with mixed
> IDE/SATA envoronment?

Yes and that is NOT related to the live installer or version 11.0.

> One reason is that there's no option to have a proper look/edit at
> partitions before starting the actual installation.

Will try it later. I am pretty sure I selected the partitions on where
to install. Otherwise my data would have been lost.

> Or the bootloader setup.

This I am not sure about. Will try it later.

> Maybe that's a feature but IMHO it's a bad one.
>
> Also are you saying that the Live Installer is fine for you?

I like the DVD installer better. I said I did not have a problem with
the live installer and think it is great for many people, especialy
those who want to try out first and have no experience with openSUSE or
Linux.

I have a bit and thus like the more options (that are confusing for new
people) that is possible with the DVD or the even harder to use Network
installer,

>> As long as your network will work.
>
> Linux is meant to be in a network. Wireless is another story but I
> haven't seen that a functional wired NIC would cause problems.

Some people only have a wireless connection, others have a dialup, and
others need drivers for their network cards. I believe it was you who
was asking about doing things while not being online.

This will happen most in postables and that is what people are buying
now.

> And all mirrors being all down is rare.

The cause of not being able to connect will be on the side of the user.
Wether this is due to Linux not being able to recognise

>> Didn't yet need it, but a valid point, provided you get the network to
>> work.
>
> See above.

Indeed.

>>> I'm a big fan of openSUSE but this one's installer is buggy.
>>
>> Then I must be doing something wrong as I had no problems whatsoever.
>
> Try upgrade :)

Please stop this. This has been talked over and over again since version
4.x came out.

1) Do a backup
2) Try the upgrade
3) If the upgrade fails, do a new installation

So all the other times other people were having problems, they were
saying the same as you now.

houghi
--
The blue light suddenly flashed on my horrified face. What a disaster!
Oh, the humanity! I never thought it would happen to me. How terrifying
it is to see for yourself "*The Blue Screen of Death*".

On 2008-07-11, houghi <houghi@houghi.org.invalid> wrote:
> Vahis wrote:
>>
>>
>> On 2008-07-10, houghi <houghi@houghi.org.invalid> wrote:
>>> Vahis wrote:
>>>> I've been installing Suses since 9.1 in 2004.
>>>> And I can tell you that 11.0 can be a bitch to install.
>>>> Its Live installer is something I won't
>>>> touch at all.
>>>
>>> I have installed it on my machines and had absolutely no problem at all.
>>
>> I think I remember you had some confusion a while back with mixed
>> IDE/SATA envoronment?
>
> Yes and that is NOT related to the live installer or version 11.0.

OK.

>> Linux is meant to be in a network. Wireless is another story but I
>> haven't seen that a functional wired NIC would cause problems.
>
> Some people only have a wireless connection, others have a dialup, and
> others need drivers for their network cards. I believe it was you who
> was asking about doing things while not being online.

It was then about being on a _slow_ connection and needing 75 megs of extra
for rsync to solve depenfencies.

>
>> Try upgrade :)
>
> Please stop this.


OK.

Vahis
--
Training new things here:
http://waxborg.servepics.com
"The only thing more expensive than training is the lack of it"
Henry Ford

Vahis wrote:
>>> Linux is meant to be in a network. Wireless is another story but I
>>> haven't seen that a functional wired NIC would cause problems.
>>
>> Some people only have a wireless connection, others have a dialup, and
>> others need drivers for their network cards. I believe it was you who
>> was asking about doing things while not being online.
>
> It was then about being on a _slow_ connection and needing 75 megs of extra
> for rsync to solve depenfencies.

So downloading 78MB for rsync is an issue, but using the Network
installer and downloading several GB isn't? Weird.

houghi
--
The blue light suddenly flashed on my horrified face. What a disaster!
Oh, the humanity! I never thought it would happen to me. How terrifying
it is to see for yourself "*The Blue Screen of Death*".